Yale Daily News

That's pretty messed up. I've suspected the same thing a lot in the dining halls. Often, the coffee has absolutely no kick to it at all, and because of the way the signage works (sometimes there, sometimes not), you just need to take their word for it that you're getting real coffee, even if it doesn't seem to be the case.

sounds like a slow news day

All this obsession with caffeine is yet another example of drug culture undermining civilization. One day it's vitamins instead of freshness, next day it's alcohol instead of wine, and now it's caffeine instead of coffee. Why is Yale so obsessed with drugs? Doesn't anyone care that these people can't brew a good espresso?

The real shame is that the "whistleblower" had quit already because she did not like her supervisor.

Now someone will probably lose their job over this, it is quite sad that this is the height of problems on a college campus such as Yale's..."I'm appalled" that this story is getting coverage.

as an employee of dining services its so funny how they watch over us for every little thing. who is watching them . while they break all the rules

espresso has less caffeine then coffee .. decaf espresso has less caffeine... but not much less.

5oz of coffee 115-170 mg of caffeine

1oz espresso 80mg

1oz decaf espresso as much as 50mg

No one is going through withdrawal from this.

More amusing to sub it the other way..

@4

Wouldn't it be a GOOD thing minor issue were the biggest problem on Yale's campus? You could have argued that there are bigger problems at Yale (there are), but that isn't what you said.

As for the manager getting fired over this, why would that be so unjust? It is an abuse of power to demand that your underlings act unethically (in this case, the cafe employees allege that they were ordered to lie to customers). The real victims here are the employees (many of whom are scholarship students who CAN'T resign in protest because they need the work-study money). If someone forced them to act unethically as part of their job, that person should be fired.

Yes, lying to customers is minor as far as unethical actions go. That doesn't make it okay for a supervisor to force his subordinates to do so.

8 should have read 6.

@9

I read #6. Your point is what, exactly?

So what if there is only a small difference between the caffeine contents of decaf and regular espresso? Heck, the difference is so small that the average customer can't tell the difference (that's why the switch worked). That doesn't make it okay for a vendor to lie to customers (and it absolutely doesn't make it okay for a manager to force his underlings to do so).

This isn't about a bunch of poor caffeine-addict Yalies tanking their finals...they won't, and we probably wouldn't really care that much even if they did. It's about a manager acting unethically.

Yeah, (as I said before) it's awfully unimportant in the grand scheme of things. Yeah, (as I said before), Yale has more important problems it should be addressing. That doesn't make it ethical for a manager to force his underlings to lie, and it doesn't make it a tragedy if he ends up getting canned over this.

@ 10

is it really ethical to be calling staff "underlings?"

that sounds a little condescending, don't you think?

Well, "subordinates" sounded awfully stilted, so it was a tough call...

In all seriousness, as someone who's been an underling many-a-time (and who's been forced by his boss to do things he hasn't much liked), I intended the word to indicate the manager's sense of superiority, not my own (and I think it does take a certain arrogance to order people to act unethically).

I do not think that word means what you think it means.

Finally a real story about something going on at Yale. Not a slew of slanted op-ed pieces speculating about someone's art project or what happens behinds ExComm's closed doors.

It may be minor and trivial to most people, but if you're a coffee addict, it could adversely affect your performance on writing papers and studying for exams. #6, please state your sources. Decaf beans have on average 2-3% of the caffeine of caffeinated beans. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decaffeination

Ethical, and ethicist, why don't you waste more YDN space and more Yale time and write an op-ed about the word "underling." Really.

Well, enlighten me, Inigo.

(unless that was @11, in which case I agree).

Comment #15 was @13.

actually, ethicist, i think the word staff does just fine. there's no need to make the structure any more divided than it already is. those underling/subordinates already feel looked down-upon.

in any case, don't you think there are more pressing matters to be considered at the moment than the caffeination of the beans in the espresso machine hoppers? for the record, you are talking to one highly caffeinated individual.

i think you'd be surprised how many people secretly get served decaf in a day. it's called barista justice. you probably don't consider that ethical, but neither do i consider your classification for people in my position.

now, would anyone like to talk politics? this silly discussion on coffee beans has grown tiresome.

@17

Yeah, this has gotten pretty ridiculous, essentially since we agree that this is hardly the most pressing issue at Yale (see my first post). Given that, we seem to be arguing over whether calling staff "underlings" is condescending.

I'll grant you that it wasn't perfect word choice, but I find your moral outrage at what you call my condescension a little misplaced because I fit the "classification for people in [your] position." I am writing as someone who has been at the bottom of many organizational hierarchies (and still is...but no, I am not and have never been employed at the CCL café), someone who has been forced by managers to do stuff he didn't much like.

Just so we're clear, I would absolutely be against the firing of a staff member who swapped beans on his own (for whatever reason). It's managers who force staff to do unethical things against their will who deserve to get fired. I wish the ones I had to deal with had been. This whole thing came out of my comment that I didn't see how it was such a tragedy if the manager got fired over this. As someone who has been in the same position as the café staff, I stand by that.

Anyway, this will be my last post on the thread...I have as much trouble as you do believing that I've spent this much time and energy arguing about CCL coffee.

And as long as we're doing "for the record" disclosures, I don't drink coffee. Seriously.

the fact is, everyone is under pressure from someone else. just because they are managers doesn't mean they are at the top of the food chain.

there will always be someone setting expectations and you do what you have to do to achieve them. the answer is not always the popular choice, but doing nothing is not an option.

my "moral outrage" was more about the dichotomy that you've created between the decision-makers and the executers. you've simultaneously damned the managers for finding a difficult solution and belittled the people who will take the abuse from everyone on the other side of the counter.

really, it's a big "so what!" it doesn't make any difference in the long run, but to make a closed-minded, one-sided judgment because you assume you know best is irresponsible.

also, i'm far from outraged. i merely have an opinion, and i'm done serving coffee to yale students today, so i have time to express it.

to be noted... both managers of the cafe were fired.

This is a clear violation of the Connecticut Unlawful Trade Practices Act, which pays triple damages. Hire Ira Grudberg.